In the olden days, when cars had hood ornaments, when you drove across the desert in the western United States, you could keep your water cool. You would fill this bag with water, soak the outside of the bag and hang it on the front of your car. The evaporation and wind would keep the water cool. Very clever idea. This was hanging in my grandfather’s garage. He kindly let me have it to hang in my garage. Later, from this blog post, I sold the bag for $40!
UPDATE 9-10-11 Amanda M. send these pictures of an Ames Harris Neville brush. Anyone have info on it?
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That’s a great bag! It holds over a gallon and is made of flax woven with jute — just porous enough to “sweat,” keeping the water cool. My great-grandfather bought the patent in 1923 and the family company (Ames Harris Neville) produced thousands of bags.
Wow Alan, that is a cool story!
Does this item have any value? I have one myself.
Carol, depending on condition, I just sold this one for $40! My grandfather almost had a heart attack laughing when I told him. He said, “I paid less than a dollar for it!” I’ve seen them sell for between $20 and $40.
Desert Water Bag: I have wanted one of these since my father’s one was trashed years ago. We traveled in the Arizona outback in the 1950′s and would not have moved an inch without our Desert Water Bag filled,dripping and hanging from the radiator cap, especially when we had a Nash Rambler stationwagon that regularly overheated. Thank you to Alan Ames for the insight about his family history with Desert Water Bags.
This will go on the wall of my log home in Northern California with other vintage items and the memories they recall.
Hi. I just bought one of these bags at an estate sale. Mine is slightly different. It doesn’t say “Saturate before using” at the top. Anyone know if this makes it older or younger than the one’s with the extra verbiage?
Thanks!
Rick
I have two bags, handed down through the family. Both have “Saturate Before Using” at the top, and I’d guess that they’re the original design. On the back in red ink is a rectangle about 3×2 inches with “for the finest in camping equipment. CAMPLETE. Tents and sleeping bags.”
“Saturate before using,” was advised to swell the flax fibers so the bag wouldn’t leak badly but would still sweat enough to keep the water cool. I poured two cups of water into one bag, and in six hours all the water had seeped into the wall.
The one I have says, “Dry open bag in sun once a week”…nothing about saturating it.
Amazing how many differences there are!
Alan, my family was the Harris part of Ames Harris Neville, which my Grandfather sold to Boise Cascade back in the 50′s (?). He just turned 100 in June. Interesting to run into you on here
Aubrey, I suspect that Harris was the married name of Josiah P. Ames’s sister, which makes us related.
Let’s figure that out. My email address is [email protected].
Alan, that address is rejecting my emails. Any ideas?
That’s because I spelled “ames” wrong. Try this: [email protected].
While going through some of my parent’s belongings I came across a round brush that says “Ames Harris Neville Co. Tents, Burlaps, Canvas 100-126 Potrero Ave Foot of Tenth St. Bages &-Twines. San Francisco.” It appears to have been used for advertisement. Does anyone have any information or a value for this brush? I can provide pic as well.
Thanks!
Amanda, if you send the pic to mrpontiac at yahoo.com, I’ll post it here with this post.
Hi Robert, I emailed the pictures to you yesterday. Please let me know if you did not receive them.
)
Thanks for your help
Got the pictures up Amanda!
I have no idea what that brush was for. Maybe my cousin Tom knows.
“Sanitary water bag made by Ames Harris Neville Co, San Francisco, U.S.A.,” mine says: “Dry Open Bag in Sun Once A Week” and “Quickly Filled” and “Easily Cleansed.”
Another difference I notice is mine has two pieces of wood at the top and a metal piece that slips over the wood to seal the bag. The spigot has a cork to seal the bag.
Fran, I don’t know for sure, but it sounds like your is much older than this one.
My dad always used a little whisk broom to sweep off the outside of a sleeping bag or tent as he rolled it up, so grasses and gravel wasn’t rolled inside. In that the brush advertises tents and canvasses, I would expect that was the purpose of the brush. Cool useful advertising item, something I am sure Alan Ames or his brother Tom would love to acquire. Enjoy! Sharon in Rural Northern California
I’ve never heard of that brush, and it would be nice to see. Any idea where I could get one?
Hi Alan, The brush that is in the pictures belongs to me, I still have it and it is for sale. Would you be interested in further communication?
Sure.
You can reach email me at [email protected] so we can exchange more information.
Thank you.
Hi,
I am researching a School Text book G11 Science and need a picture of a water bag for cooling like the one on your website. (sourced here:http://www.retrohound.com/desert-water-bag/)
Can you supply me with a hi-res image suitable for print? It needs to be A6 size; 300dpi
Full acknowledgement of the source will be given
Many thanks
Rhianne
The photo at the top of all this is 608 x 453. I don’t have any better photos, but I can take them of the two bags I have (not so clean) with high resolution and mail them to you… but after Christmas.
I just got two of these water bags from the thrift store. They were on the bottom of a box full of gardening pots. Didn’t notice they were there until I got home and started unpacking. Didn’t pay anything for the bags… for the pots… $1.00.
Can’t beat that deal! Ré the brush described above, my cousin Tom gave me one. It was apparently used as a giveaway to advertise the company.
Paul, You scored! It is always wonderful to find something secret and special at the thrift store. Once I bought a nondescript older trunk, but under the liner was wood used to reinforce the trunk. It was the crate end from a box of Shredded Wheat with the goddess Ceres. Very beautiful! Or the nice oak frame and behind the blah picture was a piece of newspaper from San Diego, dated 1908. One of the Lost and Found ads was for a Lost Black and White Donkey, A.Fels, RFD… Lemon Grove. I OWNED THE A.FELS HOUSE! So, you never, ever know what you will find, do you?
Enjoy your Desert Water Bag. I now own the pretty brush pictured on this site. Sharon Sceper
Alan, now that your cousin Tom gave you one of the brushes, and I acquired mine from Amanda Murphy, I can tell you a little more. Take a look at the very edge, as it goes over like a waterfall. In tiny print you should find “Parisian Nov.Co.Chicago.” The company, Parisian Novelty Company, still exists and you can find it and its history on the Web. The picture on Retrohound led me to believe it was made of porcelain, like old tooth powder ceramic pots with the beautiful lids. I can see now it is more like today’s political buttons, a celluloid over metal. But, the colors, detail and condition of the brush are nice.
Sharon
Sharon, Sorry, I misremembered. When I visited Tom in San Mateo over TG, he showed me his brush (just like yours). Tom’s father was the last president of Ames Harris in the 1950′s, and Tom has more company memorabilia than the rest of us. He gave me a clamp, for holding sheets of paper, attached to a porcelain-looking seal of Ames Harris. Specific details: AMES HARRIS NEVILLE CO. on top. Underneath: Burlap-Cotton-Sho-Woven. Underneath that: the company seal flanked by BAGS BAGS. Under the seal: Multi-wall Paper. Under that: Twines-Canvas Products. At the bottom in tiny letters: San Francisco Berkeley Portland Los Angeles. Stamped in the clamp itself is BULLDOG, then No. 2, then The H C Cook Co., then Ansonia, Conn.
Alan- are there any Ames’ left that worked in the business? The last Harris that worked in the business, my grandfather, is almost 101. I told him I ran into you on the internet (he wasn’t sure what that was), and he was very interested. He seemed sure he knew an Alan Ames. Who in your family would he know? I have all kinds of Ames Harris Neville memorabilia that you may find interesting, including old pictures of all the Portland factories. What does your side have laying around?
Aubrey, Your grandfather is thinking about my uncle Alan Ames, last president of Ames Harris, who’d be 104 today. My first memories of Ames Harris were when Larry Harris was president. Next was my grandfather, Fletcher, and finally Uncle Al. I’m writing our family history would very much like to learn more about the Harris family for my Ames Harris chapter. Please email me at [email protected].
Alan, as you may have figured out, Larry Harris is my grandfather. He’s going on 101, and lives in Carmel, CA. He’s still with it, and is “interviewable” if you were ever in the area. My dad, also Larry Harris, could orchestrate this. I will pass on your address no him. Where are you located?
The Larry Harris I mentioned was president of Ames Harris for many years before my grandfather, Fletcher, who was born in 1878, so it couldn’t be your grandfather — perhaps his father or uncle.
Anyway, I’d like to discuss this with someone in your family. I live in Portland. How about email or phone?
I find this thread interesting because of its history. In the late 50′s I hitchhiked from Mo. to California. It seemed every car you passed had one hanging from it somewhere and every gas station, souvenir shop and trading post had them for sale.
I just purchased one as pictured here off ebay for $41.00 shipped. I looked for one along the general route of old route 66 through Arizona to Springfield, MO. without success. Desert Water bags are getting hard to find in any condition. I talked to a guy in Albuquerque who had recently bought a new one telling me he paid $300. for it.
I suppose these things are self drying .. no? Will soap leach inside the bag after spot scrub brushing?
Buzz: It’s amazing what prices these bags get now. I seem to recall that periodic drying in the sun is good. Remember, the walls are porous, so anything inside or out will leach. If you rinse well, maybe including leaving in a pail of water overnight, I wouldn’t think there’d be a problem.
Thanks Alan. I feel I’m talking to a celebrity in the Desert Water Bag world. The bag I bought off ebay was shipped today, probably have it is 3-4 days. Anybody I talked to during my search that was younger than 40 did not know what I was talking about, just the old timers like me.
From the pix on ebay of the one I bought there is some slight soiling on the back but the rest of it looks new, the colors and lettering are nice and bright with the rope is still attached AND it is a Ames Harris Neville exactly like the one pictured above. I’d like to try to remove the spots off of the back but am cautious because of the leaching (osmosis) factor.
I’m not sure I’ll ever use it for its intended purpose but I’d like for it to be “ready” in case I do.
So, a few months ago I saw on Ebay an offer of I think 12 vintage but brand new Desert Water Bags. I thought briefly about buying them, but geez, that gets too close to being a hoarder! What the heck could I possibly do with 12 “new” Desert Water Bags. So, after reading Buzz’s comments, I went looking again. Did not find the 12 new ones, found one at $50-60 dollars (Yikes!) but found that there is a new band, Ames Harris Desert Water Bag Company People. So much for vintage, right? What a name for a band! Especially when they have no idea what one is anyway.
These posts are amazing! Who’d have thunk it about that bag? At our Ames family reunion in Twain Harte this summer (probably about 70 of us) I’ll pass on these posts.
I thought one would be easy to find in the desert southwest an area I associate with the bags. I’m not sure what even made me think of Desert Water bags on a recent trip there. I figured I’d just pick one up along the way….. no way. As I searched without success I got more determined stopping at likely looking flea markets, antique stores and asking people in restaurants. An item I thought would be plentiful turned out to be quite rare these days.
My determination caused me to pay more than I think one is worth… I do that sometimes.
A Brief History Of The Desert Water Bag
The W. A. Plummer Manufacturing Company of San Francisco, an established manufacturer of tents and canvas products, patented the Desert Water Bag on February 9, 1916. The fabric of the bag — half flax, half jute — was woven in Glasgow, Scotland. The bag was made in a variety of sizes and the top of the bag could be opened for cleaning. Some larger bags (2 gallon or so) had metal dispensing faucets near the bottom of the bag. The bags had aluminum spouts at the top left corner, with a cork stopper.
In 1923 Ames Harris Neville Co. purchased W. A. Plummer and started producing the iconic water bag under its own name at the Portland, Oregon factory. Ames Harris Neville also made water bags for Standard Oil using their Atlas brand name and for Sears Roebuck for their J. C. Higgins camping line. Bell Telephone Corp. bags were made with only the Ames Harris logo, plus the words “Bell Systems” stenciled on the back.
In the late 1950’s, Alan H. Ames (AHN’s fourth president) brokered a merger with Boise Cascade Corp, a large lumber and wood products company. Boise wanted Ames Harris Neville’s multi-wall paper bag operation and Berkeley plant as an outlet for its pulp production. In 1960 the merger was finalized and the printing on the Desert Water bag read, “Manufactured by Ames Harris Neville a subsidiary of Boise Cascade Corp.” and after a year or two the “Ames Harris Neville” was dropped. Boise began selling off all parts of Ames Harris other than the paper bag division. Coleman purchased the tent and sleeping bag line, which included the Water Bag. After several years of being produced by Coleman, the Desert Water Bag was sold to Canvas Specialty of Los Angeles, and is still in production.
The words “Saturate Before Using” have always been printed on the bag. Soaking allows the flax to swell and become more watertight. But the bag always seeps a little, allowing for evaporation which cools the water in the bag to 12 degrees below ambient. As an interesting sidelight, the singer Jackson Brown released his first album in 1972. The album cover was printed to replicate a Desert Water Bag. The album’s title was “Saturate Before Using”.
Thanks for posting that Tom. So we are to assume the bag pictured above was made in or before 1960 making any bag so marked at least 60 years old.
BTW just a few minutes ago I watched one sell on ebay made by Canvas Specialty for $66 including shipping.
Tom, Thanks for that in-depth history!
Yes, thank you Tom for the very informative history of the Ames, Harris, Neville Desert Water Bag, surely the American icon of its time. There are other brands, each with their own history, but yours is what we most remember from the days of overheating cars in the American Southwest!
Sharon Sceper, Rural Northern CA
Today I received the Ames-Harris-Neville water bag I purchased off ebay. It looks brand new with only a few stains on the back which could have been made while in storage for 50 years. I used a scrub brush without soap and all but two of those came off. The rope looks new as does the retainer string for the cap. The cap had the numbers 259 written with a crayola type marker which I assume was the original selling price, it rubbed right off. The cap gasket only shows signs of being clamped in place, not stained at all. The writing is nice and bright and not faded at all.
I don’t know how I could ask for anything better even tho I paid more than I think I should have it seems to be worth it. I’m one happy camper.
Buzz, we all have things we know we paid too much for, but which we love. Getting a Desert Bag has been your goal for some time now, so why not? I like mine, mostly because of memories of camping trips with my parents when I was a kid. Enjoy without regrets!
Sharon Sceper, Northern CA
You’re absolutely right Sharon. I was so determined to find one I would have probably bought any thing in any condition at nearly any price had I found one while traveling on our recent trip..
This bag looks brand new, no encrusted bug, no grease stains nor mud, no frays, its better than what I expected to find. It is identical to the one pictured above. I’m planning to put it in a shadow box with some other memorabilia of my travels in the SW US. I bought a small piece of petrified wood at an Indian trading post in Arizona for $0.64 cents ( $3.00 per lb.) that will be in the box as well.
So, Buzz, here is an idea for your shadow box. I had a postcard of a 1954 Copper and Cream Chevrolet Stationwagon, just like the one we drove. Got an older, but not rare, Arizona state travel map for the background of the shadow box, making sure that Flagstaff and Holbrook showed. Atop the map I put a small picture of Saguaro cactus, the postcard, a picture of my dad, brother and I from 1954, and a black and yellow license plate picture from a car magazine. An Arizona map behind your Desert Water Bag will start the theme, plus Route 66 stuff, and away you go! Have fun!
Sharon of Northern California
Sharon, the shadow box is done and hanging on the wall. I found a pic of a model T with a Desert Water bag hanging off the radiator cap, the piece of petrified wood, a small pic of a Hiway 66 roadway sign and of course the water bag. It all filled up the 16 X 20 shadow box pretty much. I’m not an artist but it looks pretty good.
Thanks for your posts..
Jerry, Western, MO
thread is full, wont take a longer post
Not sure what you mean here Buzz.
Robert I did not know there was a second page. After the post before did not show up I assumed the thread space was full. I could not find a way to delete the post…. sorry
This post has nothing to do with the water bag, but everything to do with Larry & Jane Harris. I found out today that Jane passed. I assume from your above posts that Larry is still alive. I interned for Larry when he was a legislator in Idaho, 30 years ago, Jane & Larry attended our wedding 27 years ago. I have such fond memories of both of them. While attending college at BSU they came to my “college kegger” to mix with the “young people” as Larry so fondly put it. I have the utmost respect and love for both of them. A class act is not sufficient enough word to describe them. Is Larry in Camel or in Klamath Falls. Apologies for off the beaten post. I would like to send Larry a letter & update him on the last couple years & send him a note of sympathy for Jane.
Larry, my grandfather, is absolutely still alive, and still lives in Carmel. He turns 101 this year, and still remembers most things. Yes Jane passed away last year, and was buried in the family plot in Portland. Larry would LOVE to hear from you! I can get you in touch with any of my aunts, uncles or dad to ochestrate this
Aubrey,
I have Larry address. I plan on writing him a letter (typing it out for him to read better & sending pictures of my & my family). Is Larry still able to see well enough to read? If you have an opportunity to speak to him before my letter reaches him, please tell him you “ran across” his favorite” intern. I think he should remember me. My maiden name is Wendy Kerbs Derricott. I am originally from Twin Falls & interned for Larry when was a legislator in Idaho. What a dynamic man!!! When they came to my kegger, Jane was so darling. She wore this leopard print jumpsuit (before leopard print was in). They were the life of the party, everyone loved them. It was so cool to have this late 60 year old couple hanging out with a bunch of college kids & actually having a good time. Larry & Jane could roll with everyone. Not more than two months later, Larry & Jane took me & boyfriend (now my husband) to Hillcrest County Club where we were on our best behavior. Larry was like my “Boise” dad (since my family lived in Twin Falls, not only was he like a father to me, he was a mentor, a friend and someone I truly respect. I am glad I found a relative of Larry’s and he is still here with us. My sympathy to you & your family for Jane. Please let your Grandfather know I will be writing to him soon. Is he able to write back? Thank you Aubrey.
Wendy Kerbs Derricott
Wendy, thanks for the kind words on my grandparents. I have been forwarding them to my dad, aunts and uncles. My uncle Ken, Larry’s youngest son has written you a reply and would like me to forward it to you. What’s your email address? Where abouts do you live now?. Thanks!
Aubrey,
We have been in St. Paul for the last 24 years. I am glad I ran into you. This spring I was cleaning out the entire house & ran into the last Christmas card I received from Larry & Jane in 2002. (The family is on stage singing Will,Caroline, Louise, Rev Ed, Larry, Larry II, Jane, Ken-celebrating Larry’s 90th birthday). My spring cleaning resulting in checking on Larry & Jane’s status & finding you. My email address is wlkderricott @gmail.com One last & quick story about your grandparents to pass on: They attended our wedding in 1985 in Twin Falls. The day after the wedding my parents hosted a brunch at their home for family and a few guests. Our home was located out on the canyon rim (the same one Evil Knivel jumped; this will date same of us). The morning after the wedding my husband & I were on our way out to my parents house for the brunch and we were driving along the canyon road. Along the canyon road there is a place where kids would stop and park. You could see down to the other side of the canyon where there is a traffic light of Blue Lake Country Club (thus the submarmine races). Who did we see parked out there at 10 am in the morning on the Sabath, but Larry & Jane. At first we where unsure it was them, we did not stop. Larry & Jane showed up causally late to the brunch I asked Larry about his tardness. I said, “Larry, of all things I saw you and Jane parked this morning at the submarmine races.” His reply was. “Jane wanted to see the view, so we stopped, plus how do you think we have stayed married this long. You should take our example.” I always rememher that being 25 seeing a couple past 50 parked, still in love, thinking I hope I have that kind of relationship, and I do!!!
Hello all,
So i was at an estate sale yesterday and picked up a old canvas tent. It says ames harris neville company Camplete umbrella built army tent. No poles. The tent is in very very suprisingly good condition. Theres no holes and the canvas is in great condition as well. It is appox 9′ by 9′. Does anyone know more about this? there is a tag w alot more info and serial numbers. I cant find ANY like it anywere on the net and for sure can’t find any poles. I wish i could find some. Also does anyone know its value?
Thanks
Matt
[email protected]
Matt,
The experts on Ames Harris Neville details are my cousin Tom and his son Andy. I’ll pass your post on to them.
Awesome!! Thanks so much.
Dear Matthew:
That sounds like a lucky find, once you complete the tent. My Ames, Harris,
Neville Desert Water Bag, on the reverse, reads: “For the Finest in Camping
Equipment CAMPLETE Tents and Sleeping Bags”.
Search the back rooms of your local thrift stores for the wooden tent poles
and maybe even the umbrella mechanism. I recall ours had a metal umbrella
with holes in it, to stick the metal pin ends of the poles into. All was
awkward, heavy and difficult to assemble, so that lightweight tents and
fiberglas poles were sure a welcome improvement. Enjoy, and I look forward
to hearing some of the history and how you ultimately use this piece of
history!
Sharon Sceper, Northern California
I recently found a similar water bag in some of my parents’ stuff. Maybe someone here can give me some more info about it. It looks to be new, with the rope, metal sliding clip and cork intact. But it’s not an Ames. It says (in stencil-style letters) “The Arab water bag, manufactured by the Denver Tent and Awning Co., Denver CO; soak sack well in water before using.” The price (I assume) is $1.49 and written in grease pencil or marker. Any thoughts of value would be appreciated! Thanks!
~Marjorie,
Alaska
Obviously a knock-off of our Desert WB. We’ll sue for patent infringement!
Maybe my thoughts aren’t “of value,” so I’ll punt to cousin Tom.
Who would have ever thought that an Ames, Harris, Neville Desert Water Bag would have sparked so many comments, comparisons and even renewed friendships?! If one takes a look at eBay to get an idea of “values” they are pretty much all over the place, from major CHEAP to way EXPENSIVE! And, as I always say, “Askin’ ain’t always gettin’.” Plus, it turns out there were many brands on the market, most likely patent infringements, the American way. I just like the many decorative styles, from camels to Indians and lions. Best to simply and enjoy and not worry too much about the value of something that can be found at many swapmeets or garage sales for well under $10.
Is anybody on here interested in purchasing this tent before i put it on ebay?
Thanks
Matt
[email protected]
Hello Everyone, I never imagined I’d find such a interesting read when I Googled Ames Harris Neville. I found one of the bags in a little shop near Hardy, Arkansas this past Labor Day weekend. The only thing in the shop that wasn’t already priced; I hesitated to ask, thinking he must want a fortune for it. Bought it for the offered five dollars and felt it was the deal of the day. But the reason I wanted it was the “Neville” in the name. I don’t think any of my relatives had anything to do with the company; but would like to know the first name of this guy and/or maybe a little history.
The bag I remember hanging on our car back in the 50’s wasn’t this one; it had an picture of an Indian Chief on it and has been lost in time.